Any ideas on using water instead of t...

The International Compost Sanitation Forum and Message Board: Humanure Composting Around the World: Any ideas on using water instead of toilet paper?
Author: Chemo (Chemo)
Monday, November 18, 2013 - 8:12 pm
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In southern Arizona, water is scarce...that is the value of the Humanure method. We are trying to save water, not waste it on washing our butts. This post obviously is intended for those that get lots of rainfall.

Author: Ecointerest (Ecointerest)
Thursday, July 25, 2013 - 6:54 pm
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Your last post is a very important one. The reason I love this Forum is that we can speak honestly, without too much of that "fecophobia" which Joe talks about. We can learn from each other different ways of doing things and this benefits everyone.
It sounds like you have a very good and simple method there. Thanks for sharing.

Author: Billy_thr_krik (Billy_thr_krik)
Thursday, July 25, 2013 - 9:14 am
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As to anal cleansing using the squat method. This is going to sound nasty but squatting gives the stool a clean break with no splash back! So depending on the consistency of the stool there is not real urgency to get your bum clean! Umm... But having said that, I definitely prefer to get clean as soon as possible after a dump. Presently I squat onto a tray like thing (it used to be used to place a plant vase on) lined with shredded leaves and grass. The deposit gets placed immediately after into the compost pile nd covered with clippings. Urination goes into a small plastic bucket i found lying around and also poured into the heap. All very clean and no odours and done in the beutiful surroundings.

Author: Billy_thr_krik (Billy_thr_krik)
Thursday, July 25, 2013 - 9:02 am
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Ecointerst. I live in Rio, Brazil. Flush toilets are definitely the norm here. TP does not get flushed but placed in a bin beside the bowl. Not everybody folds the TP such that the skid marks can be visible and things can get pretty gross! I definitely do not think people here (justnas anywhere else in the western world) are ready to consider giving their main product (excrement) the value it could have if were to be returned to the nutrient cycle.

Author: Ecointerest (Ecointerest)
Sunday, July 14, 2013 - 5:22 am
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Billy_thr_krik, that is most interesting comment. I agree that the squat position is preferable, especially concerning colonic health. I have been in several countries where it is the norm.
For some time the difficulties of combining the compost (Humanure) system with the squat toilet and anal cleansing with water have occupied my mind. Maybe others reading here will give us some reports of successful solutions.
Success is all to do with local culture: how much people are willing to even discuss the subject; how much they feel a need to change; the potential problem of allowing too much water into the humanure.
I don't know the answer. Partly it will depend upon how children are trained right from an early age. Our "western" seated position and flush toilets are not the only answer. Many people are most unthoughtful of leaving a facility clean and tidy after they use it.
How is it in your area of the world?

Author: Billy_thr_krik (Billy_thr_krik)
Saturday, July 13, 2013 - 3:53 pm
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So wonderful to be able to find answers to inumerable questions on this forum! In mu house we use a hose and spray nozzle set up and tp to dry off. Or drip dry with a bit of a buttock squeeze. I was thinking whether it would be compatible with the bucket and sawdust tolet and the answers on this forum have helped a lot. Imrecon the most hygienic, healthy and sustainable method would be squatting, cleaning with a hose, covering and composting. TP for,wiping is definitely gross. Sorry but the hose is the way!

Author: Rangdrol
Saturday, July 08, 2006 - 4:56 pm
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They didnt. They use a special TP and either dump it in space or bring it down with the trash.

They do however have an excellent water system developed that can recycle urine and resperiation moisture.

Author: Dan Persinger
Saturday, July 08, 2006 - 4:15 pm
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How did NASA solve the TP problem on the space station?

Author: pukha bluhm
Monday, February 17, 2003 - 11:15 am
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my partner and i, along with millions if not billions of other folk, wash our asses with water, as opposed to wiping our bums with paper. when we used a water-flush system, there was of course no problem. now, with a sawdust-bucket, we are worried that our mix is too wet, and thus anaerobic. it often (im sure this crowd can handle this) dumps, no slithers, out in a slurry. with straw and other vegetative matter etc the moisture level may balance out, i dont know. we are only five or so months into building our first humanure laden pile. ok. any ideas? any experience?

Author: DaronPage
Tuesday, February 18, 2003 - 4:48 pm
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Will you explain how that works, where do you keep the water do you use a squirt bottle?

Author: Anonymous
Thursday, May 22, 2003 - 1:54 pm
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I wouldn't worry about that, as long as you have plenty of course material in the compost pile. Compost generally dries as it breaks down, so unless you live in an exceptionally wet region it shouldn't be a problem. Of course you could also just add more dry stuff (sawdust, peat moss, etc.) right into the toilet bucket.

Author: Joe
Friday, May 30, 2003 - 11:59 am
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There is something that people use to do that in countries where it is common. I don't know how to spell it but it is pronounced bahday. It looks like a toilet but actually when you lift the lid there is a little squirting thing that protrudes from the back and points at your anus.

Author: admin
Friday, May 30, 2003 - 7:06 pm
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It's a bidet.

Author: pukha bluhm
Tuesday, August 05, 2003 - 3:54 pm
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bidets are used in some 'advanced' countries, but in many places around the world, such as SE asia and the indian subcontinent, there is a bucket of water and a scoop (sometimes a can or ladle) which is used to drop water on your crack, while wiping and whatnot with the left hand. i use a quart oil bottle with a narrow mouth (which makes controlled pouring easy). fill it up every few days from the sink. the nicest set ups ive used involve a hose like the kind common on kitchen sinks, depress the lever and a steady and diffuse spray of water is applied where needed. bye now.

Author: Herb_Wis
Wednesday, August 13, 2003 - 12:14 pm
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This is another subject after my own heart, er, "ass."

Due to hemroids, I have found toilet paper to be too harsh and use water instead. My system consists of galvanized basin of about 5 gallon capacity into which I pour about 2 gallons of hot water after my morning outhouse visit.

Attached to the basin is a short nipple and about a 12-15 inch flexible plastic hose with a solar shower nozzle head (clamp to shut off the flow). A very simple yet effective setup.

I place the basin about 2.5 feet off the floor next to the tub, then squat in the tub and use the hose to wash my ass. That mission accomplished, I hoist the basin higher up and use the hose as a regular soap and hot water shower. The rest of the water I dump over myself in a blast of hot sensation.

With this system you get totally clean where the plain toilet paper most people use leads to brown stains on their underwear and ass itching. Not very civilized IMHO.

Author: Anonymous
Monday, January 26, 2004 - 4:49 pm
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We use the water nozzles that come with many kitchen sinks (and can be got seperately at any decent hardware store), - the kind used for rinsing dishes. They are hooked up to the cold water that goes to supply the flush toilet with a little valve to set the optimum pressure. So far, it seems to work ok with the sawdust toilet, a 3 second spray adds about a half cup of water. I'd never return to toilet paper, and I'm so used to reaching for the "butt sprayer" that when I go "to town", I reach for it out of habit but am always dissapointed!

Author: DaronPage
Wednesday, January 28, 2004 - 8:36 am
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So what do you do, just air dry?

Author: Herb_Wis
Wednesday, January 28, 2004 - 1:21 pm
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Just use a towel. Your butt is so sparkling clean that well....it's a miracle!

Author: Anonymous
Wednesday, January 28, 2004 - 9:25 pm
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Some of us use small "butt rags", which are washed and reused, but personally, I just spend a few seconds in drip dry mode.
Once you get used to it, the archaic methods are treated with disdain.

Author: Herb_Wis
Sunday, February 01, 2004 - 10:33 am
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I always combine an outhouse visit with a full body shower with special emphasis on the fecally butt area. In a previous post I described my shower system. Since this is a very northern clime I use a towel to dry off.

However, in winter when I have the woodstove going, it is pleasant to towel off in front of the hot stove. You can spread your cheeks and feel the radiant heat drying and warming your freshly washed bum.

A sublime sensation!

Author: Larry Warnberg
Sunday, February 01, 2004 - 10:09 pm
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Wiping/washing methods are an important part of toilet behavior. This discussion is way overdue. Thanks to Herb for sharing his process. My favorite is to use a small amount of t-p, then wash with a Baby-Wipe, unscented.
I have been asked several times how my toilet composting toilet will adapt to the common practice in many countries of washing, rather than wiping. I think the addition of a small amount of water is not a problem. Flushless toilets should work well with both wiping methods.

Author: Anonymous
Monday, February 02, 2004 - 12:16 pm
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Baby wipes are not good for compost.

Author: declarke
Thursday, March 11, 2004 - 3:12 am
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Ummm, I'd like to use less TP. but I don't quite understand the water-based butt-wiping technique. so you, umm, you wet down the anal area and scrub it with your fingers?

and then presumably you wash your hand really well? I'm not quite so fecophobic as the average person, but I think I'd be tempted to use a LOT of water for such an operation, since I will be preparing food with those same hands. isn't there a legend or tradition about people in some nonWestern culture never using the left hand for eating because it's the butt-wiping hand?

and what about the, umm, dribble factor i.e. "used" water kind of dribbling onto clothing, your feet (I assume you're squatting during this buttwashing operation), etc?

I'd REALLY like to use less TP and I think I could get into the water method, but need to understand more about how hand hygiene (and preventing a mess) is accomplished.

de

Author: Herb_Wis
Friday, March 12, 2004 - 11:25 am
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I'll guess that I'll jump in here.

Dribble factor: Good question.

After I take a dump I come from the outhouse and strip down and get in the tub naked. No clothes to dribble on. Then you need some kind of power ass-hose. Mine is attached to a 2-gallon basin with gravity feed. But I have seen units attached to bathtub faucets that work very slick.

Yes, you aim the hose at your ass and use your hand with a gentle rubbing motion using just water at first. You WILL see fecal material run down the drain (better than in your shorts!) This I do squatting down with the hose behind me.

Then get that bar of soap and wash and rinse the same butt-ass area. This I do standing up. Repeat process 2-3 times as desired. When you are done your anal region and hands will be spotless. Shit is very water soluable and soap is good stuff too.

If you use the same opportunity to take a shower, you will be cleaner yet. That's how I usually do it. But say if I have to make a midnight outhouse visit, I skip the total shower and do just the ass region.

Another method I have used is a bucket of water and a sponge (and soap). That I have done while camping and squatting with clothes on, but again better with pants off. That method works good too, but make sure the sponge is color coded for that use only.

Does that help?

Author: oldsoapy@
Thursday, June 10, 2004 - 11:25 pm
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Just completed plumbing in a H2o water device for annal(ass). Plumb in from water inlet to toilet using proper size bushings 1/4inch copper tubing with and off valve so I can turn water on and off with spray nozzels at the end of a 1/4 plastic tubing.Really works great Sprays rear end off good.Used toilet paper only to dry off. Parts cost about $25.00.

Author: Herb
Friday, June 11, 2004 - 11:22 am
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Your system sounds similar to mine. Nice anal cleansing device eh?

I just finished building an ULTRA simple solar hot water heater for my system. Just a basin painted black with a frame over it with black painted strips of copper hanging down into the water. Then covered by clear plastic. Works good on days the sun shines (which hasn't been much lately).

Author: Mike Gibbons
Friday, December 31, 2004 - 10:39 pm
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Take a knapsack garden sprayer, one of the ones with the lever you pump up and down when you want to spray. Mount the wand on a contraption that you can pull into the correct position when you are finished your business. Mount the brass pump close to the toilet and the water supply is from a cistern that keeps the water at about 38 degrees celcius (a small concrete (thermal mass) tank in the sun maybe?). Room temperature might even be okay.

Now, pull the lever that sets the wand under your bum. Pump to get a pressure that you like. Stay seated until the water stops. Now push the lever to return the wand.

Result: clean bum and very little water in the sawdust bucket. No gravity or electric pump needed.

Author: TCLynx
Tuesday, January 03, 2006 - 10:35 am
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As far as the water wipe when not taking a shower or removing pants. People manage to do it. As many are saying dribbling water with one hand while washing with the other. Perhaps it takes a little practice. Probably doesn't require large amounts of water once you get the hang of it.
I wouldn't worry too much about your hand getting dirty, you should wash your hands when finished in any case.

As to the baby wipes not composting well. There are other moist wipes out there now days that are flushable so they should compost fine as well.

Author: Anonymous
Wednesday, February 08, 2006 - 8:48 pm
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Well, this is all most interesting. I had "Googled" the term "proper butt-wiping", after a particularly hasty, (and resultant irritating) 'improper technique', and to my gleeful surprise, 244,000 hits abounded! I instantly felt a kinship towards my other Human Beings that would ponder and postulate such an ordinary and otherwise mundane dilemma. I also noticed from my inquiry that alot of 'improper' wiping seems to be going on in the good 'ol USA. This in-turn reminded me of the prologue by Kurt Vonnegut Jr. from his book Mother Night: "Americans have dirty assholes", his reasoning for this belief is that we have a vast shortage of bidets in the USA....The internet is TRULY a wonderous tool.

Author: Herb
Thursday, February 09, 2006 - 1:24 pm
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I have made a couple minor improvements to my simple gravity-fed butt-wash/shower system (see description above).

Walmart sells enameled steel "stock-pots" with lids for around ten bucks each. Mine is 12 quarts and that is for heating butt-wash water on the woodstove or in summer on the propane burner. An 8 quart stock-pot may be better for simple solar heating of water. Walmart also sells that size.

On top of the woodstove the water in the 12 quart stock-pot with lid gets BLAZING hot in a very short time. To temper the water temp I have added a bucket of clean cold water to the bathtub area.

When I come in from the outhouse I pour the BLAZING hot water into the gravity-fed vessel (hog feed pan) with flex-hose and nozzle attachment, and then add cool water to get the PERFECT temp for washing. Using this method you get a great high class ass-washer/shower with the simplest technology imaginable.

This summer I plan to set up an old box woodstove outside so I can heat wash water with sticks and wood scraps so as not to burn expensive propane as I normally do. When the sun shines I will also us my simple solar system (dark colored stock-pot covered with clear plastic.)

Since my system is gravity fed, I fill it with a couple gallons of hot water then lift it up to an overhead rack. Usually I have water left over.

Author: Anonymous
Sunday, March 19, 2006 - 10:16 pm
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I have just returned from Egypt and now I am hooked on the water hose in the toilet pointing straight at my ass....oooohh what a clean feeling. Now I am back in USA and I will never feel clean again. I have got to find a way to fix one of those little hose thingies in my toilet! I wanna have a clean butt!

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