Urine separation

The International Compost Sanitation Forum and Message Board: General Composting Issues: Urine separation
Author: Knothead (Knothead)
Sunday, March 07, 2010 - 9:42 am
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I separate the urine in my toilets by using the Ecovita Privy Kit. That was the most expensive part of the system.
One side note, the Privy Kit doesn't work as well for my wife. Perhaps it's just her posture when she sits but some liquid ends up in the bucket. Not a real problem though as she is still on the fence about the whole idea and doesn't use it on a regular basis.

My rationale for separating the liquid from the solids is that the bucket will not have to be emptied as often. This is more important for the toilet in the boat than the one in the garage but I would rather not have to empty either one more often than necessary.
The bucket in the garage needs to be emptied about every three weeks if I use it every day.
I have a plastic jug that contained kitty litter that I have suspended at just the right height next to the utility sink in the garage for a urinal. I find that it's much easier and neater to use that than the sit-down toilet.

The contents of the urinal are reunited with the solids when it's emptied on the compost pile pretty much daily so I don't really see a down side.
Am I missing something?

PS
I hope that it is acceptable to add this post to an old thread. Some of the forums that I participate on get a little pushed out of shaped if you resurrect an old thread.
And could someone tell me if I have some settings wrong? In most of the threads that I read here, the original post is in the middle somewhere and then newer posts are both above it and below it.
I'm sure I must have some setting that will let me read a thread from the oldest post on top to the newest post on the bottom.
I'm not very computer literate. :-(

(Message edited by Knothead on March 07, 2010)

Author: mifa kinass (Mifakinass)
Tuesday, January 27, 2009 - 10:45 am
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A shewee lets women pee standing up; even into a bottle. see http://www.shewee.com/

Author: Sally (Sally)
Thursday, May 22, 2008 - 4:25 pm
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gina! You are amazing.....

I can't imagine the nervousness I would experience if I tried the newpaper trick in work...

"What's that you have in your hand bag Missus?"
(You do realise that in N.Ireland during the troubles that ladies had to open their handbags for inspection on entering any shop in Belfast!.... B) :!: )

Author: gina wuppermann (Gina)
Thursday, May 22, 2008 - 3:55 pm
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i use a stainless steel funnel inserted into a 1.5L plastic bottle. i stand over the funnel and pee, then i dilute the urine immediately with water to reduce ammonia developing over the short term (maximum 24 hours). i have taken to keeping a spare empty bottle and the funnel handy as i really hate using other people's wet toilets. and i carry a few sheets of newspaper and a plastic bag for poo - i simply fold up one sheet of paper several times, lay other sheet underneath this, squat over it, and then fold it all up neatly like a small parcel. the parcel goes into the plastic bag and then i dump it into the compost bin when i get home. bottles of pee are further diluted and poured directly on to the garden plants at the base of each plant (dilution 1:10).

Author: TCLynx (Tclynx)
Friday, December 29, 2006 - 7:16 pm
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I don't know of any "female urinals" unless you are talking about something like the travel john with the female funnel attachment.
Perhaps you could use some sort of funnel to fill a bottle with urine but that sounds a little unweildy to me. If you find something you decide to try, let us know how it works out.
I noticed that if I emptied the bucket every day, it won't have time to build up as much smell, it also won't be so full or heavy that way.

Author: catbox (Catbox)
Thursday, December 28, 2006 - 2:15 pm
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Have any female humanurists out there tried any of the female urinals? My bucket is too heavy and too smelly, so I want to try to seperate the urine. I thought I would add the urine to my outside pile right after I dump my bucket of cover materials and poop. I don't have room for two buckets in my tiny home.

Author: TCLynx (Tclynx)
Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 10:37 am
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The anonymous poster from May 23 2006. I've found out why urine is not used as the soul input into hydroponic systems. For hydroponics you need pretty small molequels for the plants to absorb them. Urea Nitrogen needs to be broken down by soil bacteria before the plants can use it. Hence why Miracle gro doesn't work as hydroponic firtilizer but it does for soil grown plants. Also Hydroponics requires pretty careful control of the nutrients. I don't know how many of the other necessary plant nutrients are present in urine or at what levels.
Using your urine for soil grown plants or composting your urine might get a better return.

Author: Aleece B. Landis (Tclynx)
Sunday, August 20, 2006 - 6:57 pm
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I have set up compost bins at my Mom and Cousin's summer place in Michigan. My cousin has wanted compost for her flowers but is very sensitive to smells so was afraid of composting. After reading the handbook and trying it out for myself, I knew I could set up compost without worry. They are still a bit fecophobic so for now at least, no poop. The urine is very necessary to getting the compost nice and hot and being able to compost any of the normally taboo compost items like meat products and fish guts. It took less than a week of three people adding urine to leaves and weeds and we were already getting up to the 110-120 range. After adding some bacon grease, we were cooking in the 130-140 range. At one point the pile was actually at 150. We have put the remains from cleaning fish and part of a chicken carcas into the pile and so far no skunks, racoons, or dogs have disturbed it and all three of those are rampant around here.

Putting the smelly stuff in the compost bin rather than the trash has really made things nicer around the trash/compost bin area. Since we are shredding all paper and cardboard trash and adding it to the compost the garbage bin doesn't overflow so much either.

All this and we only started composting in this location the beginning of August.

So I guess I'm saying separating the urine might be ok but your compost pile will probably do much better with the urine than without.

Author: rangergord
Tuesday, December 06, 2005 - 3:43 am
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While composting feces together with urine is not a problem, I am interested in separating the urine using a urinal or some other means so I can use it directly in my gardens. I can see how to build a urinal for males but where can I find a design for a female urinal? Why are there not more urine separating composting toilet designs? Separating the urine would mean far less odour in the feces chamber and less covering material would be required as well. The traditional outhouse stinks not only because it does not usually have enough carbon based material in it but because it is overloaded with urine. How many people bother with urine separation?

Author: Stephen
Tuesday, December 06, 2005 - 11:25 am
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I don't see the big benefit of seperating the two.
The less urine that goes in the bucket/bin means the more water will need to be added, unless you live in a rainy area. And I believe that urine will help produce a more active pile than with water alone.

Author: Larry
Tuesday, December 06, 2005 - 6:32 pm
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I agree mostly with Stephen that there is no big benefit separating urine, which is useful keeping the pile moist and active with the nitrogen input. There are various molded urine-diverting toilet stools on the market, and some after-market funnel devices. But it doesn't seem necessary or worth the trouble.
On the other hand, I do keep several urinals available for the guys around our place, providing a regular supply of nutrient-rich compost tea. A bucket collecting urine gets smelly fast, so I use a double-bucket system, a 3-gallon poly bucket with drain holes that fits snugly inside a 5-gallon bucket. The inner bucket is loaded with layers of finished compost, wood ashes, rock phosphate powder, and a little lime. As the nitrogen-rich urine leaches through the pile, odors are eliminated, and the resulting compost tea has a good balance of nutrients and minerals, ready for dilution and application. The compost in the inner bucket is renewed monthly. A not insignificant advantage to a urinal for males is that the sit-down toilet stays much cleaner and the seat usually stays down. Composting humanure does take a fair amount of space for piles and materials, but even apartment dwellers could use a bio-urinal, providing fertilizer for container plants on the patio.

Author: Ron Mazerolle
Tuesday, December 06, 2005 - 8:50 pm
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There is a definite advantage to seperating the urine if you use it for your gardening. Unless you've tried it you can never know. Urine spread directly on your lawn does wonders for the grass that I can't explain. Urine has advantages both in the compost and out, depends on what you want to do.

Author: Stephen
Wednesday, December 07, 2005 - 12:31 pm
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You mayby absolutely correct in your ideas, research, and sounds like, experience. There is more than one way to do the right thing. All depends on the application.

Author: Max
Sunday, December 18, 2005 - 2:44 pm
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i agree with everyone on this thread, there are definitely advantages to seperating urine, but as Stephan says it depends on the application.

the human body does not metabolize the plant-growth hormone Auxin (it remains intact through the system). if you eat green leafy veggies, sprouts etc. it will be present in your urine. in fact, Auxin was first isolated from human urine.
also, the Nitrogen in urine (urea), is directly available to plants, so bacterial processing is not required (nor desirable without the presence of sufficient carbon!). it has all the micro and macro nutrients that plants need (all in water-soluble form of course), and i remember reading something about urine containing plenty of oxygen too.
urine is THE perfect organic fertiliser and i use it on all my container plants and crops, as well as multiple hydroponic systems. dilution is key, mix it 10:1 for plants and 20:1 for hydroponics. you can use it on the soil, but too much will drive the earthworms away. always use it fresh and only mix just before you use it. you can boost the Potassium and Phosphorus levels with other organic fertilisers if you are using it on flowering/fruiting plants.
having said all that, i do include it in my humanure pile (wouldn't do without it). the potential problem with urine in composting is that the Nitrogen in urine has a very high bioavailability, while the usual cover materials (cellulose/ligin) do not, and may benefit from the addition of "quick carbon". do a keyword search for my post on 'molasses'

that's all i can think of for the moment, i'll post anything that i left out as it comes to me, or maybe i'll start a new thread on the topic.

oh, one last thing, salt build-up is a big problem with using urine as a fertiliser, which is yet another good reason to cut it from your diet.

Author: Herb
Tuesday, December 20, 2005 - 1:38 pm
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Here's how I separate urine from poop in my outhouse.

I take a large peach can and when I open it I leave a good wide hinge on the top. Then I fold the lid back 180 degrees for an instant handle.

Such pristine peach cans are placed inside my outhouse (and my guest outhouse). When a person goes out there to answer nature's call, a little sign politely asks them to pee (urinate) into the can and NOT into the poop bag. I do this to cut down on smell and mess. The urine I sprinkle around trees, etc. But you could collect it too.

When the can starts to rust or otherwise get unsightly, I just open another can of peaches (or pears).

Recycling at its best.....

Author: Anonymous
Tuesday, May 23, 2006 - 7:28 am
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What do you think as urine as a 'soul' input into a hydroponic system.
and do you think it would be beneficial to the plant if i was to take a mineral supplement and or multi-vitamim.
Chears.

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